Reading DaveWojo's journal

I'm going to tell you my secret now.

I see dead people.

Alright, I admit that I don't see dead people. My real secret is that I'm a grammar/spelling freak. I've noticed an increase in my "grammar sensitivity" in recent days. I always notice when some ends a sentence with a preposition. Just a few minutes ago, I nearly corrected my mother when she said that the chicken had come out good. (In reality, the chicken did no such thing. It came out well.)
Perhaps I am overly sensitive, or perhaps it has become acceptable to use incorrect grammar in today's society. Whichever one of those two it is, it is somewhat depressing.

GRAMMAR LESSON OF THE DAY

Incorrect: Where do you come from?
Correct: From where do you come?

Reason: Stop ending your sentences with prepositions, people.

That's all for today, folks. Good night.

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.

This post was deleted by request of the author.

"you're mighty brave in cyber-space, flame boy!"

This post was edited by fallenangel on Apr 01, 2004.

Reason: Stop ending your sentences with prepositions, people.

I do it all the time. Is it really that bad? I'm lacking a native feel for the English tongue.

'Yeah, That's what Jesus would do. Jesus would bomb Afghanistan. Yeah.' - snowlion

Reason: Stop ending your sentences with prepositions, people.

I must say we've learnt it this way, too. During my school time I've had three different English teachers and all of them taught us this -->

Where do you come from?

"*sigh* Some men are really hard to manipulate!" - Orchid

This post was edited by null on Apr 01, 2004.

Indeed. I thought "form where do you come" would be wrong. *Confused*

Or just an April 1 joke?

'Repent, Harlequin!' said the Ticktockman. 'Get stuffed!' the Harlequin replied, sneering.

Haha, I was checking grammar websites to make sure I was correct, and I read this:

"Here I'll comment on errors in written English that occur so frequently that it is often not recognized that they are errors. If you don't already recognize these errors then once you learn to you'll be amazed how often they show up."

I find it ironic that I had to stop and think for a minute before I understood what s/he said. Personally, I would rephrase the first sentence as such:

"Here, I will comment upon several errors in written English that occur so frequently that they are not often recognized as errors."
Their original phrasing stated "it is often not..." while failing to state what 'it' was. I hate it when people do that.

The author needs to take a breath at some point in the second sentence. If there were (Happy, Stoic_Slaughter?) a comma, it would be more cohesive:
"If you don't already recognize these errors, then once you learn to, you'll be amazed how often they show up."
Even so, this is still incorrect. The author does not realize, unfortunately, that contraction are not acceptable in formally written English. I would probably word it like this:
"Once you learn to recognize such errors (if you are already unable to do so), you will be astounded by how often they are made."

That the grammar lesson of the day. Someone should shoot the author of that so-called "Grammar Correction" website.

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.

(Happy, Stoic_Slaughter?)

Yes, quite. :)

For my next trick, I shall make you all disappear.

I understand what you mean about how annoying prepositions at the ends of sentences can be. I'm more annoyed about the fact that subjunctive has died, because it's apparently correct to say "If I was..." and "I wish I was...". It drives me insane. English itself changes constantly, and that's always been a big problem for me because "correct grammar" now is nothing compared to what it was a hundred years ago. Apparently it is also entirely incorrect to say will following any first person pronoun. (e.g., "I will do it later.") I thought one could say "I will" to imply emphasis, but I guess not. Honestly, I don't really mind the prepositions at the ends of sentences as long as the speaker realizes that it's wrong. (My father will say, "Who are you going with?" knowing that it's proper to say "With whom are you going?" Around here, "With whom" will get you a punch in the face. :P )

For my next trick, I shall make you all disappear.

I said shall the other day and almost got killed. At kroger.

Thats tennessee for ya. ^^;;

"Wishing on a star that's already burned out..."

My biggest pepeeves when it comes to grammar is when people use "y'all", "ain't", or never complete the "ing" sound in words ending with ing.

The sad part is, that I live in very small community 'deep in the heart of Texas'. Where the use of such grammar vices is unavoidable.

--Jami

You fail it.

Of course I had to look that up...
(Or would it be "of course I had to look up that"? "up, I had to to look that"? :-))

It would seem that this is at least a rule not everyone agrees with. (I just can't go without it. Should it be "at least not everyone agrees with that rule"?).

From H.W. Fowler's A Dictionary of Modern English Usage: (as found on multiple websites)

"It was once a cherished superstition that prepositions must be kept true to their name and placed before the word they govern in spite of the incurable English instinct for putting them late. [...] The fact is that the remarkable freedom enjoyed by English in putting its prepositions late and omitting its relatives is an important element in the flexibility of the language. The power of saying A state of dejection such as they are absolute strangers to (Cowpers) instead of A state of dejection of an intensity to which they are absolute strangers, or People worth talking to instead of People with whom it is worth while to talk, is not one to be lightly surrendered. [...] Those who lay down the universal principle that final prepositions are 'inelegant' are unconciously trying to deprive the English language of a valuable idiomatic resource, which has been used freely by all our greatest writers except those whose instinct for English idiom has been overpowered by notions of correctness derived from Latin standards. The legitimacy of the prepositional ending in literary English must be uncompromisingly maintained; in respect of elegance or inelegance, every example must be judged not by any arbitrary rule, but on its own merits, according to the impression it makes on the feeling of educated English readers.

'Repent, Harlequin!' said the Ticktockman. 'Get stuffed!' the Harlequin replied, sneering.

This post was edited by wizz on Apr 02, 2004.

I do not mean to ruin the "flexibility of the English Language." However, my post was aimed at those who do not even realize that higher institutions of education prefer that prepostions are not left at the end of sentences. Hence, the semi-humorous joke:

Person 1: Where do you go to school at?
Person 2: I go to Harvard, a school at which we do not end our sentences with prepositions?
Person 1: (after much thought) Where do you go to school at, asshole?

And with that, I go to bed.

Good night!

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.

(after much thought) Where do you go to school at, asshole?

Ooh, I must write that down. :-)

Good morning!

"*sigh* Some men are really hard to manipulate!" - Orchid

I thought I might mention that Microsoft Word began berating me when I experimented with the Grammar Check. I tried saying, "By completely ignoring the Olive Branch Petition, King George inadvertantly caused the creation of the Declaration of Independence, which would eventually cause a full-scale war to break out." The error cited was an 'End-of-Sentence Preposition' (broke out)

However...

I've decided not to criticize anyone for doing that kind of thing from now on. It may not be perfect grammar, but it is at least understandable. Our society has continually dropped our language skills standards, but I doubt many people really care. Seeing prepositions at the ends of sentences is something with which I should become familiar.

I mean...

Seeing prepositions at the ends of sentences is something that I should become familiar with.

Do whatever you guys want...I don't really care that much. I'll still take note if you do it, but I won't think less of you for it. The real problems arise when someone wants to IM me and their first sentence is:

(Please note that the Screen Name used below was created by me to demonstrate a frustrating aspect of our society. Also note, that the second SN is my real SN. Feel free to IM me. :-P)

RandomRedneck666: hey, whats you're name?
DavidWojo2000: I am not "name", at least not to my knowledge.

Or:

RandomRedneck666: aren't their parties goin on now? you coud go to one insted of puting me down for my sucky gramer?
DavidWojo2000: as far as i know, they were only going to have one party.

It's probably pointless to rant about the correct use of either 'there/their/they're,' or 'your/you're,' because I'm willing to bet you guys know them anyways. Oh well.

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.

It's probably pointless to rant about the correct use of either 'there/their/they're,' or 'your/you're,' because I'm willing to bet you guys know them anyways.

Oh, this bugs me too. The funny thing is, from my experience, the people with the worst grammar are usually native English speakers. It might be clear for them, but I always have to think about what they're trying to say.

"*sigh* Some men are really hard to manipulate!" - Orchid

The funny thing is, from my experience, the people with the worst grammar are usually native English speakers.

I'm terrible. Really, really terrible. When I'm writing by hand i don't seem to make those stupid errors, but sit me down at a computer and all Language skills fly out the window (though they suddenly seem to have very attractive wings so that i can spend pargraphs describing the graceful, yet oh so powerful, beating motion they make...)

But yes, I am a prime example of a native English speaker who is just too damn lazy to type properly half the time.

With me, i try to write at the speed in which I talk...which means i tend to leave out words and letters...

My friends have labelled it "Mel-Speak" or "Mel-Babble"

The official Mel Babble Dictionary will be available soon.

-Mel ;)

Look at me! I'm a prostitute robot from the future!

and all Language skills fly out the window (though they suddenly seem to have very attractive wings so that i can spend pargraphs describing the graceful, yet oh so powerful, beating motion they make...)

See, you're a poet. That means you may ignore grammar rules at will, and it will make you look like a visionary.

Still looking forward to getting to know you in person :-)

"*sigh* Some men are really hard to manipulate!" - Orchid

Still looking forward to getting to know you in person :-)

bleurgh...still looking forward to getting a credit card so i could be *gasp* in the same hemisphere as almost every other NAO user.

But it's the thought that counts I'm told ;)

-Mel

Look at me! I'm a prostitute robot from the future!

still looking forward to getting a credit card

Ooh, I have one, but unfortunately it doesn't give you more money that you already have. (Now that would be a great invention.)

But it's the thought that counts I'm told

Of course. :-)

"*sigh* Some men are really hard to manipulate!" - Orchid

Still looking forward to getting to know you in person

Why that? Are we going to Australia for holidays or something like that? ;)

Or are you coming to the next Europe NAO meeting?? *just curious*

"Sie wollen nichts anderes. Sie wollen kämpfen! Sie sind Soldaten! Fucking Wahnsinnige!" - Noel G.

Or are you coming to the next Europe NAO meeting?? *just curious*

i would love to go to Europe at some point in the near distant future...but being 16 and all it's a little financially difficult at the moment.

I'll probably travel in 2006, but i'm not sure if i'll make it to Europe...why is Australia in the middle of nowhere. hmph.

But it's on my wish-list

-Mel:P

Look at me! I'm a prostitute robot from the future!

See, the fact of the matter is that I have good scores in grammer at school; yet, when I take writing tests, I do so dreadfully awful. This is exactly what I hate because these damn writing test quiz you on the most useless things. Anyway, I have taken up the practice of annoying a myriad of people with these pointless grammer rules so I am able to correct my flaws in the process. I started with further and farther and never truly go off the subject. I figured it is too difficult to correct my family. My mom has too many grammer mistakes that one shouldn't even bother. My dad has perfect grammer except for further (definition of degree) and farther (distance). I started by correcting him with satisfaction because he is always correcting me. However, this has just become a bad habit (it seems like it is the only grammer rule I know); now I have to hit myself every time I correct someone because it has just become annoying. Otherwise, I'm the one who always stands in the Grammer Correction Crossfire... ohhh, that would make a cool drawing with my cowering under flaming grammer correction missles... I'll keep the title.

It is better to be pissed off than pissed on.

See, the fact of the matter is that I have good scores in grammer at school.

I do not mean to offend you in any way whatsoever, but I find it mildly humourous when, throughout this post, which is about grammar, you consistently spell the word "grammar" wrong. Sorry, I really could not help myself. :-(

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.

Good observation, but spelling grammar wrong is a spelling issue not a grammar issue

It is better to be pissed off than pissed on.

Heh... Grammar sucks. I try to use proper grammar usually, but its a bit hard with the world these days. In fact, i speak so fast that sometimes my words dont even form right, let alone be in proper grammatical order. :-P

"Wishing on a star that's already burned out..."

Good point. Here are some errors that you made that are more structurally or grammatically oriented:

See, the fact of the matter is that I have good scores in grammer at school; yet, when I take writing tests, I do so dreadfully awful.

The semi-colon after school is unnecessary; it should be a comma. Additionally, there needn't be a comma after yet. Lastly, the 'so' before is very unnecessary, and makes it sound really upper class. (say it with a British accent and you'll see what I mean).

Anyway, I have taken up the practice of annoying a myriad of people with these pointless grammer rules so I am able to correct my flaws in the process. I started with further and farther and never truly go off the subject.

Watch the tenses. This should read, "I start with further and farther, yet never truly go off the subject," or "I started with further and farther, yet never truly went off the subject."
Also "these pointless grammar rules" should be singular, if you truly never went off the subject of further vs. farther.

Sorry to berate you and all, I'm in a bad mood and need to rant at someone, so I hope you understand that I'm not singling you out. I do this to everyone. Which is exactly why I'm an annoying little bastard. :-/

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.

If i cared about my grammar, I would read over the passages I just wrote... seeing that i don't read over my passages, I don't care. School is different; i actually have to try over there. Sounding British is not a grammar error. I'm in a dumpy mood also... it is like we are twins... :-)

It is better to be pissed off than pissed on.

Heh heh. I wasn't mentioning the 'so' because it sounded British, but because it was unnecessary. Just to clarify. Hopefully I didn't offend any British folk.

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.

Heh heh. I wasn't mentioning the 'so' because it sounded British but because it was unnecessary. I just wanted to clarify that. Hopefully, I didn't offend any British folk.

It is better to be pissed off than pissed on.

Perhaps some of us are still in a dumpy mood.

This Loneliness won't leave me alone.