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Wow, you've got me.

I don't quite agree about the murder thing (I guess I'm too pragmatic a person). Other than that, I totally share your point of view. There should be a considerable inhibition treshold for abortion. The problem is, how dou you make it difficult enough for most, but not too difficult for women in need?

And were we proclaiming the same opinion all the time without noticing it? :-)

Anyways, thanks for taking so much time. You're a great partner in discussion.

When life hands you a lemon, that's 40% of your RDA of vitamin C taken care of.

There should be a considerable inhibition treshold for abortion. The problem is, how dou you make it difficult enough for most, but not too difficult for women in need?

1. A considerable inhibition treshold?
I don't understand. I always thought there is a very, very high psychological inhibition treshold, don't you think? Do you think it's easy for a woman to abort like going shopping?

2. Please explain the next sentence to me, I don't get it. I'd like to answer it, too. I don't want to misunderstand you maybe your explanation makes clear what you want to say.
Thanks!

"Sie wollen nichts anderes. Sie wollen kämpfen! Sie sind Soldaten! Fucking Wahnsinnige!" - Noel G.

There should be a considerable inhibition treshold for abortion. The problem is, how dou you make it difficult enough for most, but not too difficult for women in need?

The thing is that this ought to be self-regulating, like most things really ought to be. Like I said, there are too many laws and not enough people with common sense. The threshold should be self-imposed because people don't want to abort as a first option.

The trouble is that many do want to because (and this is where Orchid jumps on me) it's the easy way out.

Now, it's not easy for most of them, but it is easy for enough of them (read "teenage girls who would rather abort than tell their parents that they're pregnant") that it's a big problem, and the threshold is not self regulating.

Wherever a good threshold is needed and it just isn't self regulating, that's where laws are needed. I am not a law maker, so I have no idea what kind of laws would strike the right balance, but I believe that laws right now are far too lax.

And were we proclaiming the same opinion all the time without noticing it? :-)

You know, I think we were! It's always nice to come to a consensus, isn't it?

Anyways, thanks for taking so much time. You're a great partner in discussion.

Ditto to you. It's been a good discussion.

C

Sig Wanted -- Apply Within

Wherever a good threshold is needed and it just isn't self regulating, that's where laws are needed. I am not a law maker, so I have no idea what kind of laws would strike the right balance, but I believe that laws right now are far too lax.

I think it's not only about making abortion more difficult. Preventive measures like (e.g.) better sex education would probably help avoid many potential abortions.
I kinda like the idea that you need to have a talk with a specialist before you're allowed to abort (as it is in Switzerland). The specialist has to explain you all the alternatives before you make your final decision.

Another thing is the cost of the abortion. IMHO women should have to pay it themselves if it's not an emergency or so.

Oh, and if their partner pressures them to abort, he should at the very least be forced to pay for it & be with her (=present) during the actual abortion. :-)

Ditto to you. It's been a good discussion.

Merci! :-)

When life hands you a lemon, that's 40% of your RDA of vitamin C taken care of.

Did you read my questions?

Doesn't seem like... :-(
Maybe my participation isn't needed anymore anyway...

"Sie wollen nichts anderes. Sie wollen kämpfen! Sie sind Soldaten! Fucking Wahnsinnige!" - Noel G.

This post was edited by Orchid on May 23, 2002.

I agree with every statement Null just made.

With that, I think I'll start wandering more in the other topic areas. I'm exhausted!

C

Sig Wanted -- Apply Within

Amen to that......I feel like gave birth to a calf. Sideways.

quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

This post was edited by gentledeepwaters on May 23, 2002.

Amen to that......I feel like gave birth to a calf. Sideways.

A quick poll for everyone. Which is more graphic? That statement above, or the "silent scream" videos?

:)

C

Sig Wanted -- Apply Within

No matter which one it is, GDW's example sure sure hurts a lot more!

When life hands you a lemon, that's 40% of your RDA of vitamin C taken care of.

Can you remember having felt anything by the age of 2 months or so? I don't think you're killing a human being. You're killikng something that could become a human being.

I think this is the most absurd argument I have ever heard. Sorry Orchid, but I don't have any words to express my feelings! Do you know that at the age of 4 weeks (gestation period - which is 2 weeks after the pregnancy) the baby's heart has already started beating? Do you know that at the age of 8 weeks, the brain has also started functioning? This is ridiculous! How can you be so ignorant of a life inside you?

After reading your argument I decided to actually watch the abortion video on silentscream.org. It is in 5 parts. It shows an abortion of a 12 weeks old foetus (a woman is not able to feel the baby until it is 20 weeks old). 20 weeks is the legal age of the baby to be allowed for abortion by many countries (India has that age, and abortion is legal in India since 1970). And believe me Orchid, I vomited when I was watching part 2 of the video. By the time I finished watching it's 4th part, I vomited again. I just couldn't watch the little baby trying to escape the instruments that the doctor had inserted to kill the baby. The baby did open it's mouth, as if trying to scream, before it's head was torn apart from the rest of the body. I just didn't have the courage to watch the 5th part of the video in which the brain of the baby was crushed! Sorry, if I am being gory here in explaining the details, but I challenge you, and everyone on NAO to just watch all the 5 parts of the video which show an actual abortion thru an ultrasound at this website!

Please no one is trying to force you for anything. I am not with people who will force a decision on anyone whether it is a decision to kill your baby or a decision to not let you die, when you don't want to live. Everyone has the power to make the choice. I am just trying to say that whatever decision anyone takes, don't tell me that since it's legal, or since you don't have any attachments to the baby, it's okay to kill. I don't want to go into a debate as to when does a life start, but I do know when you are killing a preborn, it is alive! And, can express it's pain, just like any human being would do.

Just watch the video and let me know what do you think, when the doctor is trying to crush the body parts of 12 week old foetus, and the heartbeat of the baby increases from 104 times per minute to 120 times per minute, and the baby is trying very hard to escape the clutches of death? Just let me know then whether it's okay to kill?

Love is blind, but marriage is a real eye opener.