Reading Philosophy

I take your point about aspiring to be a garbageman - if there is a garbageman out there totally satisfied with his (or her) job, then they are probably alone in that feeling. But I don't think that constant dissatisfaction with who you are, and the relentless desire to become 'more' is the path to satisfaction.

To set your goals higher is to never be content with yourself. Most people can't live like this, in fact.

I disagree. Alot of people working 9-5 in mild boredom/displeasure may be unhappy, but to keep distract themselves from the reality of their situation, they aspire to improve. If they coukld just get that promotion, just get a bit more money, just make a few more freinds, then everything will be okay, right? Such a mindset can easily distract you from the truth of who or what you really are. And then, if such a goal is achieved, then people realise that what will actually make them satisfied, is another promotion, and more money! It becomes a vicious cycle of need and dissatisfaction.

The 'American Dream', as you yanks have it (i'm guessing you're american from your spelling of 'colour'), is based on the ideal that society is classless, and all men are equal. A dream that is slowly creeping around the world, avec capitalist democratic culture. This creates the aspiration that anyone can become successful. So people belive that they can. But not everyone does, only a few. And such a desperate reliance on a dream with such a low success rate, is what leaves millions of people around the world grinding at the 9-5 until they work no more.

The point that i am trying to make is that if you can become more satisfied in your life and who you are, without clinging to the hope that somehow, someday things will just improve, then you can be happier. We should always push ourselves, but some people rely on dreaming of more, when all they have is monotony. I dont think that constantly challenging and trying to improve yourself is the only way to happiness . You just have to break the mould, and free yourself from social conformities, and experience life!! The world that's out there!!

All credit to you hawkeye, if you can push yourself so, and be happy with it. But if the garbageman didn't dream of being a millionaire, then maybe he wouldn't be so unhappy as a garbageman...

Please, let's not argue. You love your wife; I love your wife. You see, we're on the same level here

I stick with my sentiment that if a garbageman were content with his life, it would be for reasons other than his occupation.

It's an interesting irony, the 'American Dream'. Not everybody can be what they aspire to be. But I believe this 'classless' ideal is the type of mentality that would have averted the dark ages. I honestly feel the dark ages was a product of everyone in the serf class 'committed' to the life that was laid out in front of them in combination with religion promising great things in the life beyond. This was the way they coped, only by the promise that things will be better later.

Though, I'm not going to insist that the 'American Dream' doesn't have its downfalls, you must admit, it aspires greatness from those who aren't great. Perhaps they can't ever hope of being great, but at least in some small way, they are better than they were before they thought they were never going to amount to something.

If the world should blow itself up,the last audible voice would be an expert saying it can't be done

All this talk about garbage management workers (I'm not being politically correct, I am only using a more clear term), has made me want to add to this post.

As it is, without waste management we would be doomed.

If a truck of some sort didn't haul off our waste, it would pile up very fast. May be the latter isn't a profound statement, but think about it a second. What would it be like to have an alley full of trash. What of people who place their trash on the crubside of their residence?

The pay for waste management workers is higher than most people realize. While it may be a dirty job, it sure would be a rewarding feeling to have helped save a neighborhood from being infested with varmin and bugs.

What comes around goes around.

All this assumes that our job defines what we are and all our aspirations surround just one area of existence. It also implies that those who do not seek power or money are in some way inferior. Yet money and power lead to conformity. A lawyer or banker is the essence of conformity. So is our garbage disposal operative.

I sell in a callcenter and I certainly conform to the wage slave scenario, I have to work. But do I conform to other preconceptions attached to that label? No I don't. I write historical articles, I read widely and write fiction. I enjoy books about philosophy and the physics of time. I am a genealogist. I enjoy films both for entertainment and intelligence purposes. I am an athiest and don't believe 90 percent of what I am presented with via various types of media. I am also an amateur student of human psychology. In my experience the 'I am superior' tone of the original post really means I am trying to justify myself. The poster seems desperate to prove that he is nonconformist whilst being afraid that he is conforming to society.

I have also married twice and had two kids which may be seen to conform to society yet bringing up children forces you to challenge your preconceptions every minute of every day.

It would be more accurate to ask if there are any areas of you life in which you don't conform but if so then so what, conforming or not is a life choice too.

I thinks therefore I is

This post was edited by Turings_child on Apr 08, 2008.

I just found this thread. I know first hand what looking for something wonderful in the mundane can do.

I also know about the people you talk about, the zombies. Sometimes I think that it's so easy to fit yourself into a routine that works that it becomes a box.

I tend to like to throw boxes out the window because boxes limit everything.
Sometimes breaking out of the mundane and halted world that can hold us can be as simple as making a different choice than was made the day before.
Sometimes it starts there.

Sometimes it's taking a closer look at everything we thought we knew about ourselves and seeing if that's really who we are or is it more of what other people have told us they want us to be.

One thing to remember about breaking out as it were, is that not everyone will be comfortable with what you want to do, your part of their routine don't forget, and the last thing that some people want is their rountine disrupted. So they will fight you to keep you where you are.
something to think about.