Reading Current Events

Dec 21, 2002 16:22 # 7209

Eliza *** wants to know...

Please help: My first Christmas

100% | 11

As you all know it's my first Christmas ever this year and of course I'm very excited. Unfortunately many things I read about Christmas appear to be very confusing and contradictory.

Can you help me? I have so many questions:

  • In many countries celebrating Christmas involves to sit in front of a dead tree and to eat candy out of your socks. What is the meaning of this ritual?

  • I have no tree. Is it allowed to get one from a forest?

  • I wanted to buy presents for all of you at Amazon but when I tried to order it said I needed money to do it. Can I give a present without money? Will you be angry with me if you don't get a present?

  • Who's the Christ Child and who's Santa Claus? Are both the same person? Or are they two friends sharing the work?

  • Since I'm new to the whole Christmas business I wonder how Santa Claus is supposed to get hold of my address. Do I have to sign up somewhere? Also since it's the 21st already I'm in fear that it might already be too late to sign up. Won't I get any presents now?

I don't want to do anything wrong, please help!

- Eliza

Dec 21, 2002 17:39 # 7214

lockedNloaded * is getting sarcastic...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

76% | 6

Children today are forced, by the fierce and yeasty tenor of our times to grow up much faster than they ever did before, which brings us to the problem of Santa Claus.

Santa is a problem because he does nothing but set kids up for being disillusioned. In fact, it may be time for Santa Claus to retire, considering that these days if a big fat old dude in a red suit actually broke into a house from the roof, there are five-year-olds who'd know where to go to get a gun and shoot him. Hearing that Santa Claus was just one big lie was a huge disappointment for me when I found out--a couple of years ago--and it'll continue to be a downer for future kids unless we do something about it now. I say we take this fat old compulsive giver and shoot him in the head! That's my position: Kill Santa Claus. :-)

Dec 26, 2002 17:12 # 7276

gentledeepwaters *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

Grins.....if you ever get the opportunity to BE Santa and perpetuate this .....this traumatizing rip off of young childrens' future faith in mankind, you'll find it is more fun that being the child you were.

Tha's what keeps Santa going........ROCK ON.....Santa!!!!

quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Dec 21, 2002 22:32 # 7226

Martin *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

91% | 5

Dear Eliza,

I don't know if I can be of any help, but I will try and answer at least some of your questions. Please note this is my personal view of things and its by no means a common opinion and some statements might as well hurt some religous thinking souls, so not exactly sure if this will help you at all.

You know, darling, first of all Christmas once was a religous holyday. Christians all over the world celebrate the birth of their Gods son on the 24th of December. Got no idea really why they choose the 24th of Dec. It cant be the snow, cause there definitley was NO snow back in Palestine where this guy called Jesus was born as son of Joseph, a carpenter, and Maria, who claimed to be still a virgin when Jesus was born. Dont get too much confused by this fact, Christians have this ability to add certain details to their stories to make it more interesting I guess, nevermind.

After Jesus was born it is said three noble men from the far east - named Caspar, Melchior and Balthazar - travelled half way round the world guided by a star to meet this little baby and bring some presents to honor him. I mean, gimme a break, that Baby would have been at the age of ten before those guys arrived from the different parts of the world on their donkies and camels and stuff if they just took off the day he was born, anyway, remember, Christians!

So somehow during the centuries the giving of presents was meant to be a sign as to revive this little scene. Its actually not the tree that's the important sign (not exactly sure, but are there firs in Palestine anyway?) but the star people put on top of it, which is a symbol for the star that lead the way for those three noble men. Guess it would look pretty much dopey just to sit in front of star in the middle of the living room, and how to fix it at all? Think thats why they just put a tree under it, so, with lots of imagination, one might think you're standing in a forest and there is a star shining above the trees... well...what can I say... Christians!

Meanwhile at the beginning of the 3rd millennium after this little incident and living in a capitalistic society, where there is nothing that is not turned to gold if there is the slightest chance to make it, I guess most people got no clue about what they are actually celebrating. They are just happy about another three days off from work and for that even swallow the bitter pill to see their long lost relatives, which they only disturbed last Christmas for the last time. Cause if you look at it *everybody* does it, not only Christians, just everybody, and its almost like a crime and you are suspiciosly looked at if you decide to NOT take part in this mega consumption trip.

People just buy stuff for the ones they (have to) love, and most people think the more the present is worth the more they can show their love, which is complete bullshit of course, but you know that, Eliza. So, giving presents nowadays is no longer a sign of love or honor for someone, but just a cumbrous ritual one has to perform once a year, and everybody just hopes nooone else will notice that all he had to give was just mendacious. At the same time everybody hopes to get the real crackers this year finally for themselves. Infact its reduced to a rather selfish, mindless and of course useless way of spending money, I mean, who was ever happy about a new pair of socks or a new pyjama?

And, as always, our American friends had to invent the wheel for the second time (well, maybe that is cause of their lack of history and the permanent struggle to finally have their own, got no clue). It was not enough to just hope for the people's duteousness to go out and spend money like mad, no, of course they had to invent a new figure with more advertising appeal than this little child called Jesus has. That's how Santa came up. You know, this guy riding a huge coach with a bunch of reindeer in front of it makes far better stories and of course better pictures than just a baby in its cradle. And in addition the complete party is no longer tied to the Christian rituals at all, but its truely a feast for everybody! So I guess from the Christian point of view the Santa figure has got nothing in common with the Christ Child, but after all it serves the same purpose, being the kinda role model for the ideal capitalist.

You know, Eliza, really celebrating Christmas needs no money. It needs now tree, no star, no snow, no Santa, no child, no presents, just nothing. All it takes is a heart full of love. Christmas can be everyday, not only on the 24th of Dec. Its Christmas each time, when you feel love for someone and show it, honest, pure and simple, with a kiss, with just a look or a touch. Its Christmas when you realize that all your values are within yourself, not in your garage or the size of your house. Its Christmas when you share what you've got without expecting anything in return, even if its just your smile, and I'm sure there's someone out there who will be happy to see a smile on your face...so, make it Christmas for him/her whenever and as often as you feel like!

After decades of construction my website is finally up an running: www.kkds.de

This post was edited by Martin on Dec 21, 2002.

Dec 24, 2002 19:57 # 7252

Eliza *** smiles...

Thank you!

77% | 9

Hello Mr. Martin and Ms Gentledeepwaters,

thank you very much for your stories and answers. They were probably among the best presents a girl will receive this Christmas. Yes, I think I understand it all much better now.

Frank sounds like he is a very lonely person. Maybe someone should hug him!

Yours,
Eliza

Dec 22, 2002 02:26 # 7227

gentledeepwaters *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

100% | 5

As you all know it's my first Christmas ever this year and of course I'm very excited. Unfortunately many things I read about Christmas appear to be very confusing and contradictory.

Grins....how do you like the feeling?? I am glad you feel excited..that is a good thing to feel..Yes, they are contradictory..so I can understand how it would confuse you. But in a way...it is a time of mystery and magic. Made so by a story about a babe born almost like yourself.

In many countries celebrating Christmas involves to sit in front of a dead tree and to eat candy out of your socks. What is the meaning of this ritual?

I'm not sure really how it came about, the tree or the stockings full of treats, perhaps to bring a scent of outdoors inside, to use a tree, a sign of mother earth, born to live out in the open sky, to bring it inside and decorate it with anything at hand in the pioneer days....in those days we cut them anyway for warmth later, for fire to cook with, build with, but I cannot think of anyone who does not respect or admire a tree.

The socks filled with treats were the only presents children received back in those days.....so a clean sock of each child was stuffed with nuts, prized and used sparingly, perhaps rock candy, the awesome prize of fresh fruit or dried fruit depending on the area you lived in....perhaps an embroidered hankerchief, a hand made wooden toy, or rag doll..Handcrafted in secret by parents for this day.

I have no tree. Is it allowed to get one from a forest?

In parts of Texas, you can have any mesquite tree or cedar tree you want....with the landowners blessing.

Can I give a present without money? Will you be angry with me if you don't get a present?

You are a present. A bit of magic all by yourself. You have already given me a present by being excited and by your questions.

Who's the Christ Child and who's Santa Claus? Are both the same person? Or are they two friends sharing the work?

There was a story written about a foretelling of a child born of a woman but no earthly father, would grow and teach of a "new faith" in a "new God"....in a time when every land had many Gods, many ways they had to give to these Gods in order to receive blessings, to hold back fate. In order to keep up with the largess demanded of these gods, you had to be pretty rich to afford the offerings, or in a position to not become the sacrifice yourself. This God would not ask sacrifice, only faith. So, the first God "for the masses" as a man named Karl Marx once said.

Santa Claus has grown up out of a fable...of a kind man who probably lived in a small village and knew all the children, who would leave small treats or lumps of coal....for children who had been exceptional or "tacky" during the year.

Since I'm new to the whole Christmas business I wonder how Santa Claus is supposed to get hold of my address. Do I have to sign up somewhere? Won't I get any presents now?

Santa seems to know every child's address..You might ask Jaz that question. I think he will also know if you will get any presents.

......I don't want to do anything wrong, please help!

You really can't do anything wrong, darlin', this is a time that was based on a magical story about a very special child...out of it grew something that touched or changed a whole world...it's just a day someone picked out long ago to make us adults pause in our daily endeavors, hopefully reach out in some way....especially to children.

quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

This post was edited by Jaz on Dec 22, 2002.

Dec 22, 2002 03:53 # 7229

frank *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

20% | 11

This post was deleted by request of the author.

Dec 22, 2002 14:21 # 7233

andromacha *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

80% | 4

It was not enough to just hope for the people's duteousness to go out and spend money like mad, no, of course they had to invent a new figure with more advertising appeal than this little child called Jesus has. That's how Santa came up. You know, this guy riding a huge coach with a bunch of reindeer in front of it makes far better stories and of course better pictures than just a baby in its cradle. And in addition the complete party is no longer tied to the Christian rituals at all, but its truely a feast for everybody! So I guess from the Christian point of view the Santa figure has got nothing in common with the Christ Child, but after all it serves the same purpose, being the kinda role model for the ideal capitalist.

(This is Hawkeye)

I beg to differ. Perhaps this is the image Santa Claus has come to mean some corporate gimmic for all the rich money grubbing capitalists out there. For the young innocent children out there however, Santa Claus represents a hope and aspiration for better and greater things. When you were a child, I know Santa Claus did not represent some marketing ploy. He represented everything you've ever dreamed of having. Of course nobody should lose sight of the true meaning of christmas, but then my family never did. We went to church the Sunday before Christmas as we did every Sunday contrary to typical views of Americans and our celebration of "Christmas."

For the record, the American version of St. Nicholas, or Santa Claus originally came from the Dutch version called Sint Klaas. The Dutch settlers in New Amsterdam (New York) brought this tradition to America. Today, this mythical character is still alive and well and is known all over the world as: Nicholas of Myra, Shengdan Laoren (China), Pere Noel (France), Kris Kringle (German derrivation?), Father Christmas, St. Nicholas, Santa Claus or "Santa" in America. It isn't soley celebrated in America needless to say. I refuse to look at Christmas in such a negative perspective. Bah humbug to you and your scrooged views. :)

Italy no longer accepts illegal immigrants. Mr. B sink their boats!!!!!!!

This post was edited by andromacha on Dec 22, 2002.

Feb 08, 2003 05:10 # 8665

jdonnell *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

72% | 3

I think you contradicted yourself. First you said that "Santa Claus did not represent some marketing ploy". Then you said that as a kid "[Santa] represented everything you've ever dreamed of having." They're the same :) Santa represents materialism to both children and the "rich money grubbing capitalists".

Dec 22, 2002 17:22 # 7234

frank *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

14% | 11

This post was deleted by request of the author.

Dec 24, 2002 19:01 # 7250

frank *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

3% | 8

This post was deleted by request of the author.

This post was edited by frank on Dec 24, 2002.

Dec 27, 2002 13:45 # 7288

POWF ** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

97% | 7

Have fun, take out all your frustration.... The more bad ratings the better...

It seems to me like you are taking out your fustrations....and I'm not to clear of the reason you are doing this.

I dont understand why you would post such inapropritate posts that not only irratate (hence the red ratings) the people who are trying to post their own ideas about Christmas...but make you look petty and arrogant.

The reason Eliza was used in this string was because, yes, like you said, she (or should I say it) isnt real. It was used as an innocent example of someone with no ideas or opinions on this holiday. Only a catalyst used to start a conversation among the people of NAO (but I'm sure you must of relized this)....it surley wasnt meant as a way for Frank to write random un-intelligent posts and attempt to egg people on asking for red ratings.

But hey, if thats what you wanted to do, then so be it. Next time start your own string titled "Rate this Red so I can write more annoying posts prentending like I'm better then everyone else".

We should of brought a bag of rocks....

Dec 27, 2002 16:20 # 7293

Jaz *** agrees...

Re: Frank

?% | 1

Nicely put, POWF.

'Yeah, That's what Jesus would do. Jesus would bomb Afghanistan. Yeah.' - snowlion

Dec 09, 2003 22:33 # 17704

blueyefreak * replies...

Where who

?% | 1

Where you live?
Whats your last name?

live your life to the fullest you only get one shot at it!

Dec 10, 2003 10:18 # 17728

ginsterbusch *** laughs about...

Re: Where who

Dont you know Eliza? :D

cu, w0lf.

beards are cool. every villain has one!

Jul 07, 2004 13:16 # 24112

Alexis * replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

40% | 2

Y was it your first christmas? I don't get it

Good friends'll bail you out of jail.Best friends'll be sittin with you sayin;'Damn, we f*cked up'.

Jul 07, 2004 15:51 # 24123

Bunk *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

?% | 1

U should snd Eliza a email, and ask her y!!!

:p

"History is more or less bunk." - Henry Ford

Nov 27, 2004 17:01 # 29557

jesse * replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

Eliza, this is a response that may shed a realism on your desire to be involved...the book I reference is about a human practice older than Christmas...TERRORISM...just finished the last book...yes, I have read enough and believe I know what this unsocial connection is between humans...the migration of the human species seems to take this phenomenon of "how can we be and do what we want without becoming paranoid or persecuted or persecute-rs?" as part of our evolving into the intended purpose of humans...from "them" to those used by "them" the stigma of "all the same from the top down" keeps 'status quo' from leaping to evolution...we as a species have too much invested in us to have evolved to making pain a primary method of change...some of us could be/are different from "as is forever"...terror in 2000 years has not worked and is not the answer for change but the constant reminder that we are going to change( which is natural)...I believe in the year 2000 there were children born who are going to be the "exception and the new rule"...I believe there will be 15 years of blatant ignorance, so when the millennium babies are ready to make their move, they will not have to convince those who have been (and can be made) aware...the transition will be with a definite voice and no violence committed by the "MB's"...I believe the next migration is imminent whether on earth or away from earth...evolution has about a drop of tolerance left for this experiment called life...life is approaching the next phase...some will be included, many will not...should be interesting...there is no discussion of terrorism...it, as an act, will not be part of "the future"...I did feel it was important to know the concept and it's history and influence...I believe "pray for love, love to pray" will be a hive mind mantra that will work better than Xmas for group positive thought and evolution
...I believe I have learned enough to be patient and non-judgmental...what is, is...what will be, is coming...there is no fear in what was always there...nobody fabricated the future...and nobody can stop it from being...I apologize for taking humans so serious... they are the best of what they are, for whatever they are...

Nov 30, 2004 02:02 # 29663

MelMel *** replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

I apologize for taking humans so serious...

regretfully (or is it thankfully?) Eliza is not human.

-Mel ;)

Look at me! I'm a prostitute robot from the future!

Nov 18, 2005 04:54 # 40576

2hander * replies...

Re: Please help: My first Christmas

You might as well do what i do, be an athiest, life is so much simpler babe x


Small text Large text

Netalive Amp (Skin for Winamp)